Researchers grow Alzheimers's in a petri dish
October 13, 2014 8:14 AM Subscribe
Breakthrough Replicates Human Brain Cells for Use in Alzheimer’s Research In the past, what once seemed to be promising breakthroughs in Alzheimer's Disease research have later petered away to nothing, but this latest announcement in the New York Times sounds like genuine good news. A new method of creating a brain in a dish can clear away one major obstacle in research, by providing an truer medium on which to test drugs, and a clearer indication that the theory that amyloid accumulation that leads to plaques and tangles is correct.
Whose brain cells, I wonder? I checked the Methods section of the (unfortunately paywalled) Nature paper and it says they used these ReNcell VM immortalized human neural precursor cells, commercially available from EMD Millipore for only $2,285. The data sheet says they were extracted from an anonymous 10-week-old fetus, which is disappointing and probably prohibited by the Book of Leviticus, but on the other hand: The year is 2014 and you can grow an immortal vat brain for the approximate price of a 2003 Hyundai Elantra with "low miles."
posted by theodolite at 8:48 AM on October 13, 2014 [15 favorites]
posted by theodolite at 8:48 AM on October 13, 2014 [15 favorites]
Wow, that's super promising. Now we just need a credible blood-brain barrier simulator, so we can figure out what drugs we might be able to get in there.
posted by gurple at 8:53 AM on October 13, 2014
posted by gurple at 8:53 AM on October 13, 2014
Whose brain cells, I wonder?
Abbie Normal....
posted by Kirth Gerson at 9:52 AM on October 13, 2014 [16 favorites]
Abbie Normal....
posted by Kirth Gerson at 9:52 AM on October 13, 2014 [16 favorites]
I think, therefore I exist
as a lump of cells in a petri dish.
posted by nzero at 9:56 AM on October 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
as a lump of cells in a petri dish.
posted by nzero at 9:56 AM on October 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
Once again science asks "Can I?" instead of "Should I?"
posted by Pr0t35t3r at 10:20 AM on October 13, 2014
posted by Pr0t35t3r at 10:20 AM on October 13, 2014
"Should I cure Alzheimer's?" seems like a pretty easy one.
posted by squinty at 10:26 AM on October 13, 2014 [47 favorites]
posted by squinty at 10:26 AM on October 13, 2014 [47 favorites]
Once again science asks "Can I?" instead of "Should I?"
I really hope you never have a friend or loved one affected by this horrible disease, but statistically the chances are you will. I hope you can see that for anyone who has, this is exactly what science should be doing.
posted by lumpenprole at 10:42 AM on October 13, 2014 [11 favorites]
I really hope you never have a friend or loved one affected by this horrible disease, but statistically the chances are you will. I hope you can see that for anyone who has, this is exactly what science should be doing.
posted by lumpenprole at 10:42 AM on October 13, 2014 [11 favorites]
Once again people say "Science Bad!" instead of "Bioethics is an extremely complex issue."
posted by Metafilter Username at 10:49 AM on October 13, 2014 [11 favorites]
posted by Metafilter Username at 10:49 AM on October 13, 2014 [11 favorites]
Once again science asks "Can I?" instead of "Should I?"
Science rarely asks the "should" question, unless it is required to vet research grants. In this case, you can be assured that this question was asked and answered affirmatively in front of one committee or another, several times, even if you, personally, do not like the answer.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:40 AM on October 13, 2014 [12 favorites]
Science rarely asks the "should" question, unless it is required to vet research grants. In this case, you can be assured that this question was asked and answered affirmatively in front of one committee or another, several times, even if you, personally, do not like the answer.
posted by a lungful of dragon at 11:40 AM on October 13, 2014 [12 favorites]
Science journalism drinking game rule #14: drink when a Gina Kolata article uses the term "breakthrough." Chug if it's in the title.
posted by cgs06 at 11:44 AM on October 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by cgs06 at 11:44 AM on October 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
Would you be chugging piña coladas?
posted by Apocryphon at 12:04 PM on October 13, 2014 [4 favorites]
posted by Apocryphon at 12:04 PM on October 13, 2014 [4 favorites]
I for one hope that we move to testing everything on lab grown tissue, neural and otherwise, and I hope these models become more complex and useful for science.
Maybe with viable facsimiles of the human system, vivisection can become unnecessary. Vivisection has a lot of ethical issues and inefficiencies. We would be much further along in many avenues of research if we didn't have to deal with the basic differences between our "test subjects" and ourselves - rats and other animals used in these tests do not share our physiology and their systems do not respond to many things in the same way that ours do. Rats do not develop Alzheimer's naturally, or many types of cancers, for example.
It also rubs me the wrong way that people can go "Oh no, think of the fetal neural cells", but not consider the existing death toll of research as it stands today.
posted by Feyala at 12:08 PM on October 13, 2014 [8 favorites]
Maybe with viable facsimiles of the human system, vivisection can become unnecessary. Vivisection has a lot of ethical issues and inefficiencies. We would be much further along in many avenues of research if we didn't have to deal with the basic differences between our "test subjects" and ourselves - rats and other animals used in these tests do not share our physiology and their systems do not respond to many things in the same way that ours do. Rats do not develop Alzheimer's naturally, or many types of cancers, for example.
It also rubs me the wrong way that people can go "Oh no, think of the fetal neural cells", but not consider the existing death toll of research as it stands today.
posted by Feyala at 12:08 PM on October 13, 2014 [8 favorites]
That death toll also includes humans who suffer from side effects not discovered through animal testing.
posted by Feyala at 12:09 PM on October 13, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by Feyala at 12:09 PM on October 13, 2014 [3 favorites]
" ... researchers created what they call Alzheimer’s in a Dish ...AKA "Jan in the pan."
posted by octobersurprise at 12:39 PM on October 13, 2014
AKA "plaques on a plate".
posted by saturday_morning at 12:51 PM on October 13, 2014
posted by saturday_morning at 12:51 PM on October 13, 2014
This is fascinating! I'm excited to see what comes of this research.
posted by chatongriffes at 1:30 PM on October 13, 2014
posted by chatongriffes at 1:30 PM on October 13, 2014
Now we just need a credible blood-brain barrier simulator, so we can figure out what drugs we might be able to get in there.
Don't we know a fair amount about this, and about ways to try to sneak in molecules that might not cross in their first developed iteration? It may not be something medchem has mastered but is presumably something it deals with often.
posted by atoxyl at 2:37 PM on October 13, 2014
Don't we know a fair amount about this, and about ways to try to sneak in molecules that might not cross in their first developed iteration? It may not be something medchem has mastered but is presumably something it deals with often.
posted by atoxyl at 2:37 PM on October 13, 2014
well i guess the answer to the "how can i prove i'm not a brain in a jar" question is now, and forever, "you can't lol".
posted by emptythought at 5:31 PM on October 13, 2014 [3 favorites]
posted by emptythought at 5:31 PM on October 13, 2014 [3 favorites]
Maybe with viable facsimiles of the human system, vivisection can become unnecessary.
That's absolutely the hope. Ten years ago I worked in a neuroscience research lab, and every week we had to sacrifice two pregnant rats to harvest the fetal pups' brains for primary neural cultures. (That's the word you use in the vivisection biz, sacrifice.) The dams were put into essentialy a coma with carbon dioxide, and then the pups were removed and their brains were harvested. We had to do it that way, and work as quickly as we could, so the neural cultures would be viable. If I ever felt a little funny about doing this, I just had to read about Alzheimer's for a while to be all right again. No one enjoys using animals in this way, and I imagine my old lab-mates are turning cartwheels at the promise of a usable culture that doesn't involve animals.
posted by pH Indicating Socks at 8:13 PM on October 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
That's absolutely the hope. Ten years ago I worked in a neuroscience research lab, and every week we had to sacrifice two pregnant rats to harvest the fetal pups' brains for primary neural cultures. (That's the word you use in the vivisection biz, sacrifice.) The dams were put into essentialy a coma with carbon dioxide, and then the pups were removed and their brains were harvested. We had to do it that way, and work as quickly as we could, so the neural cultures would be viable. If I ever felt a little funny about doing this, I just had to read about Alzheimer's for a while to be all right again. No one enjoys using animals in this way, and I imagine my old lab-mates are turning cartwheels at the promise of a usable culture that doesn't involve animals.
posted by pH Indicating Socks at 8:13 PM on October 13, 2014 [1 favorite]
If you read Gina Kolata
And like medical fame
If you don't like chiropractors
And can grow half a brain
If you like milking mice at midnight
Wear a lab coat as a cape
I'm the subject you've looked for
Tell your PI we've escaped
posted by benzenedream at 9:23 PM on October 13, 2014 [8 favorites]
And like medical fame
If you don't like chiropractors
And can grow half a brain
If you like milking mice at midnight
Wear a lab coat as a cape
I'm the subject you've looked for
Tell your PI we've escaped
posted by benzenedream at 9:23 PM on October 13, 2014 [8 favorites]
Whose brain cells, I wonder? I checked the Methods section of the (unfortunately paywalled) Nature paper and it says they used these ReNcell VM immortalized human neural precursor cells, commercially available from EMD Millipore for only $2,285. The data sheet says they were extracted from an anonymous 10-week-old fetus, which is disappointing and probably prohibited by the Book of Leviticus, but on the other hand: The year is 2014 and you can grow an immortal vat brain for the approximate price of a 2003 Hyundai Elantra with "low miles."
I don't see why that is 'disappointing' to you, honestly. Serms to me that these cells, which, let's be clear, would otherwise have simply been destroyed, are being put to the best possible use: helping us research diseases of the brain and perhaps one day find a cure.
As far as ethics go, according to this source:
The ReNcell VM line was derived from ten-week gestation fetal midbrain tissue that was obtained from Kings College Hospital, London, whereas the ReNcell CX line was derived from a 14-week gestation fetal cortex obtained from Advanced Bioscience Resources (Alameda CA, USA), both following normal terminations and in accordance with nationally (UK and/or USA) approved ethical and legal guidelines.
posted by misha at 9:32 PM on October 13, 2014 [2 favorites]
I don't see why that is 'disappointing' to you, honestly. Serms to me that these cells, which, let's be clear, would otherwise have simply been destroyed, are being put to the best possible use: helping us research diseases of the brain and perhaps one day find a cure.
As far as ethics go, according to this source:
The ReNcell VM line was derived from ten-week gestation fetal midbrain tissue that was obtained from Kings College Hospital, London, whereas the ReNcell CX line was derived from a 14-week gestation fetal cortex obtained from Advanced Bioscience Resources (Alameda CA, USA), both following normal terminations and in accordance with nationally (UK and/or USA) approved ethical and legal guidelines.
posted by misha at 9:32 PM on October 13, 2014 [2 favorites]
"Bioethics is an extremely complex issue."
It's not though when your position is 'all life is sacred' or 'life begins at conception'. It's tough to equate a dish full of progenitor cells to a full formed human suffering a devastating end of life event, but then again, these are the same people who call swallowing a pill to prevent implantation murder (as long as it's not their own daughter who just made a little mistake). Once again, the neo-luddite screams no and damn the benefits, because reasons.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:06 AM on October 14, 2014 [1 favorite]
It's not though when your position is 'all life is sacred' or 'life begins at conception'. It's tough to equate a dish full of progenitor cells to a full formed human suffering a devastating end of life event, but then again, these are the same people who call swallowing a pill to prevent implantation murder (as long as it's not their own daughter who just made a little mistake). Once again, the neo-luddite screams no and damn the benefits, because reasons.
posted by T.D. Strange at 4:06 AM on October 14, 2014 [1 favorite]
(Not to be totally obtuse here, but can someone explain in small words what the bioethics issue is, here? Is it the fact that fetal cells were used to start? If that's the "issue", whatever, I hope no one you know or love ever gets Alzheimer's.)
I don't really understand the issue of cause and effect here. Do we already know that it's the formation of the clots and tangles of plaque that are responsible for the cognitive declines? Or is that just a sign of the brain being ravaged, the fever response to a virus? This advance seems like it would be amazing for testing drugs that can prevent or maybe reverse these plaques, but is that the key or is it just treating the fever with ice?
posted by RedOrGreen at 7:27 AM on October 14, 2014
I don't really understand the issue of cause and effect here. Do we already know that it's the formation of the clots and tangles of plaque that are responsible for the cognitive declines? Or is that just a sign of the brain being ravaged, the fever response to a virus? This advance seems like it would be amazing for testing drugs that can prevent or maybe reverse these plaques, but is that the key or is it just treating the fever with ice?
posted by RedOrGreen at 7:27 AM on October 14, 2014
Metafilter: disappointing and probably prohibited by the Book of Leviticus.
posted by CynicalKnight at 2:03 PM on October 14, 2014 [1 favorite]
posted by CynicalKnight at 2:03 PM on October 14, 2014 [1 favorite]
well i guess the answer to the "how can i prove i'm not a brain in a jar" question is now, and forever, "you can't lol".
posted by emptythought at 8:31 PM on October 13
On the other hand at least you'll be senile soon enough. Depending on how you go that might not be so bad, considering all your experiences are just imagination/implanted thoughts. Though it was rough on the family, I have to say I'd rather go out like the older relatives I had who were dumb as dogs toward the end than the ones that were completely lucid and praying for death from the rheumatoid arthritis.
posted by mcrandello at 5:14 PM on October 14, 2014
posted by emptythought at 8:31 PM on October 13
On the other hand at least you'll be senile soon enough. Depending on how you go that might not be so bad, considering all your experiences are just imagination/implanted thoughts. Though it was rough on the family, I have to say I'd rather go out like the older relatives I had who were dumb as dogs toward the end than the ones that were completely lucid and praying for death from the rheumatoid arthritis.
posted by mcrandello at 5:14 PM on October 14, 2014
I don't see why that is 'disappointing' to you, honestly. Serms to me that these cells, which, let's be clear, would otherwise have simply been destroyed, are being put to the best possible use: helping us research diseases of the brain and perhaps one day find a cure.
My fault for being vague. I wasn't disappointed by the use of fetal cells per se but by the fact that the source was an anonymous terminated pregnancy rather than, say, the 140-year-old preserved brain of Edward H. Rulloff.
posted by theodolite at 10:32 AM on October 15, 2014
My fault for being vague. I wasn't disappointed by the use of fetal cells per se but by the fact that the source was an anonymous terminated pregnancy rather than, say, the 140-year-old preserved brain of Edward H. Rulloff.
posted by theodolite at 10:32 AM on October 15, 2014
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'Cinnamon toothpaste is the best'
'Turtles breathe thru their butts'
'Do do do do doo I'm lovin it!'
-not a neurologist.
posted by ian1977 at 8:45 AM on October 13, 2014 [14 favorites]