Detroit Coney
February 26, 2024 2:36 PM Subscribe
"While no one place can definitively claim to be the birthplace of the Coney dog, Michigan, by sheer volume and duration of its Coney restaurants, makes a strong bid. Detroit’s famous Coney dog restaurants, American Coney Island and Lafayette Coney Island, followed Todoroff’s Original Coney Island in Jackson, Michigan, which dates its beginning to 1914."
'The Cult of the Detroit Coney Dog, Explained.'
If you find this intriguing, you might want to read Jamie Loftus’ Raw Dog, a book about hot dogs, America, COVID, family, and the decline of a relationship. It’s a good read.
posted by GenjiandProust at 3:02 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
posted by GenjiandProust at 3:02 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
Funny. Never heard of Coneys and Detroit being a thing. But, I'm from Flint, where we think it's our thing.It's weirdly localized sometimes. There certainly are Coney Dog restaurants all over the Detroit suburbs but 40 miles away in Ann Arbor, a town full of restaurants supported by tens of thousands of ravenous-for-fast-food university students, they barely have a presence - or at least that was the case back when I lived in the area (during my years the campus-area hot dog market was dominated by Red Hot Lovers, which served Chicago-style Vienna Beef franks and, to a lesser extent, Le Dog. As far as I know both are gone now.)
posted by Nerd of the North at 3:04 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
Angelo's is a whole 'nother level of coney nirvana. Worth the cost of a flight there to try one, if they taste anything like they did in the 1990s.
posted by semper ubi sub ubi at 3:12 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
posted by semper ubi sub ubi at 3:12 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
"Now drink your Nehi and eat your Coney Island."
RIP Ryan
.
(Howard)
posted by Windopaene at 3:13 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
RIP Ryan
.
(Howard)
posted by Windopaene at 3:13 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
Biggest memories of childhood trips to Flint: bottle of grape Nehi from the vending machine at the gas station on the way (glass bottles, of Nehi, in five flavors, from a vending machine, in the 80s!), Six Flags Autoworld, and Coney Dogs.
A couple years back, getting ready for the last pop-up/closing party for my one time restaurant, held at a bar in Tokyo, I wanted to do something special, something that said, yeah, this is me, so I went down the Coney rabbit hole, finding out that essentially every town in Michigan has its own variation. Flint, Detroit, Lansing, hell, even Jackson and Kalamazoo have their own versions, and that's how I found out I'd grown up within three miles of a Coney place in Kalamazoo, but had never been.
I went with a Flint version, and I was actually able to track down beef heart for it, which gave it a really great, deeper, more iron-y flavor than previous attempts. It was awesome, and tasted like childhood, or like I think childhood tasted, and that's good enough for me. Of course, trying to explain it to the people who came, I ended up having to explain it as "Michigan chili dog" which I guess is close enough.
The story I've heard, and believe, as it hits all the American notes, is that people were hesitant to buy something called a hot dog in the era where the Jungle was talking about just what was in those sausages, but there was also lingering anti-German sentiment because of WW1, so using a German name was a no-go. On the other hand, Coney Island was famous enough that it was a shorthand, simple name to get across the idea of a nice summer night out at the amusement park, and it stuck.
A couple years ago, when my mom passed away, and we went back to Flint to be with her side of the family, I managed, while getting reacquainted with a friend I hadn't seen since high school, to scarf down a couple. I'd had great hopes, but goddamn, they were not good. It was probably my fault for going to a place in suburban Detroit, though.
Goddamn, I want a Coney Dog. That, and having been smacked in the face with a lifetime of memories right before I have to teach a full day of classes, I want to go somewhere quiet and cry for a bit. Food, loss, and memory, all wrapped up in a loose meat stew on top of a hot dog, covered with mustard and onions.
posted by Ghidorah at 3:17 PM on February 26 [19 favorites]
A couple years back, getting ready for the last pop-up/closing party for my one time restaurant, held at a bar in Tokyo, I wanted to do something special, something that said, yeah, this is me, so I went down the Coney rabbit hole, finding out that essentially every town in Michigan has its own variation. Flint, Detroit, Lansing, hell, even Jackson and Kalamazoo have their own versions, and that's how I found out I'd grown up within three miles of a Coney place in Kalamazoo, but had never been.
I went with a Flint version, and I was actually able to track down beef heart for it, which gave it a really great, deeper, more iron-y flavor than previous attempts. It was awesome, and tasted like childhood, or like I think childhood tasted, and that's good enough for me. Of course, trying to explain it to the people who came, I ended up having to explain it as "Michigan chili dog" which I guess is close enough.
The story I've heard, and believe, as it hits all the American notes, is that people were hesitant to buy something called a hot dog in the era where the Jungle was talking about just what was in those sausages, but there was also lingering anti-German sentiment because of WW1, so using a German name was a no-go. On the other hand, Coney Island was famous enough that it was a shorthand, simple name to get across the idea of a nice summer night out at the amusement park, and it stuck.
A couple years ago, when my mom passed away, and we went back to Flint to be with her side of the family, I managed, while getting reacquainted with a friend I hadn't seen since high school, to scarf down a couple. I'd had great hopes, but goddamn, they were not good. It was probably my fault for going to a place in suburban Detroit, though.
Goddamn, I want a Coney Dog. That, and having been smacked in the face with a lifetime of memories right before I have to teach a full day of classes, I want to go somewhere quiet and cry for a bit. Food, loss, and memory, all wrapped up in a loose meat stew on top of a hot dog, covered with mustard and onions.
posted by Ghidorah at 3:17 PM on February 26 [19 favorites]
Also, the secret is crushed saltines to thicken the sauce.
posted by Ghidorah at 3:19 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
posted by Ghidorah at 3:19 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
the Coney rabbit hole
ISWYDT
I'm disappointed "Coney dog" doesn't mean it's made of Oryctolagus cuniculus meat.
posted by Greg_Ace at 3:22 PM on February 26 [6 favorites]
ISWYDT
I'm disappointed "Coney dog" doesn't mean it's made of Oryctolagus cuniculus meat.
posted by Greg_Ace at 3:22 PM on February 26 [6 favorites]
They are! Several of my Detroit-area college buddies introduced me to the coney. (I was from the other side of the state, no coneys there, but good liverwurst)
posted by caution live frogs at 3:36 PM on February 26
posted by caution live frogs at 3:36 PM on February 26
Next time I am in Michigan, (likely never again), I will make it a point to get one... I'm avoiding yummy onions now, but would make an exception.
posted by Windopaene at 3:42 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by Windopaene at 3:42 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
Angelo's is a whole 'nother level of coney nirvana.
God I love the internet.
Alas, Angelos is no more as I just passed it two and a half hours ago.
in the 90s there were lines out the door at 2:00 a.m. to get in and lines to the cash register when they closed at 4:00 a.m. it was one of Flint's cultural icons as you could see truck drivers and shop workers, students, nurses, politicans, all sorts of folks in one place.
I still have an Angelo's ashtray.
I see it fitting and proper to dedicate this post to one of Americas most irascible and controversial contemporary local politicians, to mark his passing Saturday, councilman Eric Mays.
posted by clavdivs at 3:43 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
God I love the internet.
Alas, Angelos is no more as I just passed it two and a half hours ago.
in the 90s there were lines out the door at 2:00 a.m. to get in and lines to the cash register when they closed at 4:00 a.m. it was one of Flint's cultural icons as you could see truck drivers and shop workers, students, nurses, politicans, all sorts of folks in one place.
I still have an Angelo's ashtray.
I see it fitting and proper to dedicate this post to one of Americas most irascible and controversial contemporary local politicians, to mark his passing Saturday, councilman Eric Mays.
posted by clavdivs at 3:43 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
And have gone into the hot dog rabbithole...
Frankfurters, seem to have been all pork, in a sheep casing.
These, seem to have come from an all beef side. Interesting.
I think most random hot dogs you buy are a mix, though, when I was having a hot dog phase I would certainly see "all-beef" on packages. Need to find some gluten-free hot dog buns, as I now want a hot dog...
posted by Windopaene at 3:47 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
Frankfurters, seem to have been all pork, in a sheep casing.
These, seem to have come from an all beef side. Interesting.
I think most random hot dogs you buy are a mix, though, when I was having a hot dog phase I would certainly see "all-beef" on packages. Need to find some gluten-free hot dog buns, as I now want a hot dog...
posted by Windopaene at 3:47 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
in the detroit episode of Anthony Bourdain's parts unknown series
there's a vignette on the Coney Dog
posted by MikeHoegeman at 3:49 PM on February 26
there's a vignette on the Coney Dog
posted by MikeHoegeman at 3:49 PM on February 26
It's interesting to me that big chains that are either drive-ins (Sonic) or have their roots in drive-ins (A&W) refer to their chili dogs as coneys. Neither has any connection to Michigan, as far as I can tell.
posted by bgrebs at 4:02 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by bgrebs at 4:02 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
FYI Ann Arbor has plentiful Coneys under the Mark’s and Leo’s brand - west side, northeast, near south, and farther south down by Saline (plus 2-3 others a little farther out). Much more than just Coney dogs, they’re the best diner food that southeastern Michigan has to offer.
posted by saintjoe at 4:06 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
posted by saintjoe at 4:06 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
downtown, uptown on Jackson racks.
late seventies my father took me to a Coney in Ypsilanti. it was one of those screen door clang, bowed wooden floor, Chet Atkins on the a.m. chrome napkin holders aux Formica. I didn't like coney sauce I don't like the onions and I don't like mustard. this guy would slowly grill Koegel viennas with a light olive oil and a dash of pepper, steamed bun and ketchup. fries and milkshake.
posted by clavdivs at 4:41 PM on February 26
late seventies my father took me to a Coney in Ypsilanti. it was one of those screen door clang, bowed wooden floor, Chet Atkins on the a.m. chrome napkin holders aux Formica. I didn't like coney sauce I don't like the onions and I don't like mustard. this guy would slowly grill Koegel viennas with a light olive oil and a dash of pepper, steamed bun and ketchup. fries and milkshake.
posted by clavdivs at 4:41 PM on February 26
I was from the other side of the state, no coneys thereThey are less widespread but not literally absent. G + L is a Muskegon-area institution with several locations.
posted by Nerd of the North at 4:43 PM on February 26
Despite the proximity to Coney Island, in North Jersey these are called Hot Texas Weiners [sic]. The linked article notes that they are often (as with the Detroit version) Greek-food-derived. Also, they are...shudderliciously....deep fried.
posted by HeroZero at 4:52 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
posted by HeroZero at 4:52 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
So wait so wait so wait…
Can anyone who’s had both tell me how Detroit coneys are similar/different to Cincinnati coneys? We also have the whole meat packing town thing, the Greek-Armenian chili thing, the truly superior junk food for dinner thing. Let’s throw down!
posted by toodleydoodley at 4:59 PM on February 26 [4 favorites]
Can anyone who’s had both tell me how Detroit coneys are similar/different to Cincinnati coneys? We also have the whole meat packing town thing, the Greek-Armenian chili thing, the truly superior junk food for dinner thing. Let’s throw down!
posted by toodleydoodley at 4:59 PM on February 26 [4 favorites]
I've had both but it's been a while since I had a Detroit coney.
The Detroit recipe linked above uses cumin, paprika, and chili powder, whereas Cincinnati chili also has chocolate, cinnamon, and a few other spices. From my recollection of tasting Detroit's, it's a lot closer to what I would consider regular chili (i.e. TexMex), while Cincinnati is a whole deal unto itself.
posted by tubedogg at 6:04 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
The Detroit recipe linked above uses cumin, paprika, and chili powder, whereas Cincinnati chili also has chocolate, cinnamon, and a few other spices. From my recollection of tasting Detroit's, it's a lot closer to what I would consider regular chili (i.e. TexMex), while Cincinnati is a whole deal unto itself.
posted by tubedogg at 6:04 PM on February 26 [2 favorites]
It's interesting to me that big chains that are either drive-ins (Sonic) or have their roots in drive-ins (A&W) refer to their chili dogs as coneys. Neither has any connection to Michigan, as far as I can tell.
I don't know about A&W but Sonic is based in Oklahoma and we have coneys in Oklahoma (at least in Tulsa; I don't know about OKC). Ours seem a bit different. They look closer to what I've seen with regard to Cincinnati coneys. Steamed bun, griddled dog, mustard, chili, onions and cheese (if you get one with everything). Like Detroit and Cincinnati it seems to be a Greek immigrant thing.
posted by downtohisturtles at 6:27 PM on February 26 [5 favorites]
I don't know about A&W but Sonic is based in Oklahoma and we have coneys in Oklahoma (at least in Tulsa; I don't know about OKC). Ours seem a bit different. They look closer to what I've seen with regard to Cincinnati coneys. Steamed bun, griddled dog, mustard, chili, onions and cheese (if you get one with everything). Like Detroit and Cincinnati it seems to be a Greek immigrant thing.
posted by downtohisturtles at 6:27 PM on February 26 [5 favorites]
Never had a Coney but love a Skyliner.
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:31 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by seanmpuckett at 6:31 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
The Detroit recipe linked above uses cumin, paprika, and chili powder, whereas Cincinnati chili also has chocolate, cinnamon, and a few other spices.
That makes me think - I've gone through making various permutations of chili in my day (not related to hot dogs, which I don't eat because I don't happen to like them)...perhaps an "all the kinds of chili" FPP is in the cards. Pondering....
posted by Greg_Ace at 6:31 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
That makes me think - I've gone through making various permutations of chili in my day (not related to hot dogs, which I don't eat because I don't happen to like them)...perhaps an "all the kinds of chili" FPP is in the cards. Pondering....
posted by Greg_Ace at 6:31 PM on February 26 [3 favorites]
and, to a lesser extent, Le Dog. As far as I know both are gone now.
Bit of a derail, but Le Dog is certainly still around (just not in the old kiosk—it's indoors in a Main Street mall now)! That said—
FYI Ann Arbor has plentiful Coneys under the Mark’s and Leo’s brand - west side, northeast, near south, and farther south down by Saline (plus 2-3 others a little farther out).
Fair point, but it's also true that these locations are often fairly peripheral with respect to the university and the majority of student housing. I think it's fair to say that while coneys are available in Ann Arbor, they don't really occupy a central place in the city's food scene or culinary self-image. (Perhaps because of the student population, which inevitably includes a large portion [~48%] of non-Michiganders?)
posted by the tartare yolk at 6:32 PM on February 26
Bit of a derail, but Le Dog is certainly still around (just not in the old kiosk—it's indoors in a Main Street mall now)! That said—
FYI Ann Arbor has plentiful Coneys under the Mark’s and Leo’s brand - west side, northeast, near south, and farther south down by Saline (plus 2-3 others a little farther out).
Fair point, but it's also true that these locations are often fairly peripheral with respect to the university and the majority of student housing. I think it's fair to say that while coneys are available in Ann Arbor, they don't really occupy a central place in the city's food scene or culinary self-image. (Perhaps because of the student population, which inevitably includes a large portion [~48%] of non-Michiganders?)
posted by the tartare yolk at 6:32 PM on February 26
Coney island in Kalamazoo was my favorite. The steamed buns and grilled, ceaseless dogs had a powerful combo texture, and the bun and cheese sauce had enough sugar, so the whole thing was a heavenly light, fluffy, chewy treat.
posted by rebent at 7:01 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by rebent at 7:01 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
seems to be a Greek immigrant thing
I think, not only is this likely the answer, it might be the root of a shocking level of American shared culinary experience. I don't know that I've ever been to a town in America that didn't have a diner with a twenty page menu, where, buried somewhere in the menu, was a full page or two of gyros, spanakopita, or other Greek food.
Theo & Stacy's in Kalamazoo, The Liberty in Libertyville, I think we could go on for days, finding out that the thing that really connects us all is that diner in town that had that really, really good all day breakfast, and a fantastic French dip.
posted by Ghidorah at 7:20 PM on February 26 [4 favorites]
I think, not only is this likely the answer, it might be the root of a shocking level of American shared culinary experience. I don't know that I've ever been to a town in America that didn't have a diner with a twenty page menu, where, buried somewhere in the menu, was a full page or two of gyros, spanakopita, or other Greek food.
Theo & Stacy's in Kalamazoo, The Liberty in Libertyville, I think we could go on for days, finding out that the thing that really connects us all is that diner in town that had that really, really good all day breakfast, and a fantastic French dip.
posted by Ghidorah at 7:20 PM on February 26 [4 favorites]
Speaking of rabbit, did you know 'coney' historically rhymes with 'honey'? They stopped calling bunnies coneys around the time 'cunny' as slang for genitals gained wide currency. And even when using the antiquated term, we now rhyme it with 'stony' to avoid the awkward pronunciation.
posted by SaltySalticid at 7:28 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by SaltySalticid at 7:28 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
Well, every dog has his day today.
posted by y2karl at 7:42 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by y2karl at 7:42 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
I love a Detroit-style coney, a Cincinnati-stylr with chili or a Chicago-style fully dressed with a pickle spear, sport peppers, onions, sweet relish and celery salt. Hell, I just love hot dogs.
Rick Sebak is my exemplar!
posted by Big Al 8000 at 8:17 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
Rick Sebak is my exemplar!
posted by Big Al 8000 at 8:17 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
Kalamazoo coney dogs are a source of pride if you are from that city. If you know about putting mustard on your coney with a large wooden stick you have credentials. The Root Beer stand hot dogs are a derivative of the coney and are simply remarkable with a frosty root beer on a warm summer day. If you get down with Nagles Top Dog you are a true Kalamazoo OG.
posted by jasondigitized at 8:28 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
posted by jasondigitized at 8:28 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
at one point when visiting in-laws in Ypsilanti, we stopped at a coney place and I decided it would be a good idea to order a "loose dog," essentially just coney dog topping on a bun with no hot dog
I did not fully appreciate, when ordering it, just how profoundly unappetizing it would be to look at, though the "loose" in the name did certainly foreshadow this development
posted by DoctorFedora at 9:39 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
I did not fully appreciate, when ordering it, just how profoundly unappetizing it would be to look at, though the "loose" in the name did certainly foreshadow this development
posted by DoctorFedora at 9:39 PM on February 26 [1 favorite]
Love the Cincinnati style dog but Seattle has the most unusual dog I have tried.
posted by nofundy at 2:36 AM on February 27
posted by nofundy at 2:36 AM on February 27
Wait a second.
In northern New York they call something very similar to that a Michigan.
posted by nothing.especially.clever at 3:33 AM on February 27 [3 favorites]
In northern New York they call something very similar to that a Michigan.
posted by nothing.especially.clever at 3:33 AM on February 27 [3 favorites]
A big treat in my childhood was when mom started heating-up a can of this stuff. It meant coneys for dinner!
posted by Thorzdad at 5:30 AM on February 27 [1 favorite]
posted by Thorzdad at 5:30 AM on February 27 [1 favorite]
They are less widespread but not literally absent. G + L is a Muskegon-area institution with several locations.
When I said “other side of the state” I should have clarified that I meant “so far south it’s practically Indiana, where Polish influence (not Greek food) reigned supreme”.
Having said that, there was one restaurant that we’d go to with my wife’s grandma, and it had a straight amazing Greek salad, huge blocks of feta and full anchovies with plenty of red onion. So yeah, I think the idea that all great diner experiences have Greek roots very well might be a theory with legs…
posted by caution live frogs at 5:35 AM on February 27
When I said “other side of the state” I should have clarified that I meant “so far south it’s practically Indiana, where Polish influence (not Greek food) reigned supreme”.
Having said that, there was one restaurant that we’d go to with my wife’s grandma, and it had a straight amazing Greek salad, huge blocks of feta and full anchovies with plenty of red onion. So yeah, I think the idea that all great diner experiences have Greek roots very well might be a theory with legs…
posted by caution live frogs at 5:35 AM on February 27
I grew up not far from Coney Island and did a newspaper internship in Jackson, during which I wrote a long piece about the Coney dog. Pretty sure I spoke to the Todoroff's folks...
posted by AJaffe at 8:50 AM on February 27 [1 favorite]
posted by AJaffe at 8:50 AM on February 27 [1 favorite]
For the millionth time, Cincinnati chili, from the chili parlors here in Cincinnati, does not contain chocolate. Can you find recipes that call for it? Yes. But the places that have made Cincinnati chili since the dawn of Cincinnati chili do not include chocolate in the chili.
posted by cooker girl at 11:41 AM on February 27
posted by cooker girl at 11:41 AM on February 27
I think, not only is this likely the answer, it might be the root of a shocking level of American shared culinary experience. I don't know that I've ever been to a town in America that didn't have a diner with a twenty page menu, where, buried somewhere in the menu, was a full page or two of gyros, spanakopita, or other Greek food.
You are correct.
posted by cooker girl at 11:44 AM on February 27
You are correct.
posted by cooker girl at 11:44 AM on February 27
It's the wierdest thing, though. I've never had Skyline in Ohio. I only ever had it in Sunrise, Florida, where it was in regular rotation when I was a young shithead. And according to the map, the single(?) location is still there, in the same place. Jesus. That was at least thirty years ago.
posted by seanmpuckett at 11:48 AM on February 27
posted by seanmpuckett at 11:48 AM on February 27
The Lafayette location wa shut down in 2022 for five weeks due to rat droppings; I picked up this commemorative shirt in the Eastern Market to mark the occasion.
posted by MiltonRandKalman at 1:07 PM on February 27 [1 favorite]
posted by MiltonRandKalman at 1:07 PM on February 27 [1 favorite]
The Lafayette location wa shut down in 2022 for five weeks due to rat droppings; I picked up this commemorative shirt in the Eastern Market to mark the occasion.
Still better than American!
posted by Preserver at 1:35 PM on February 27
Still better than American!
posted by Preserver at 1:35 PM on February 27
The late, much lamented Chili, Mustard, Onions on Brush Street in Detroit had an amazing vegan Coney dog.
posted by Preserver at 1:47 PM on February 27
posted by Preserver at 1:47 PM on February 27
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